So about the new kickstarter

[Lienn]

[quote author="Home15" data-cid="11432" data-time="1404726183">

It would have been better if they made the 100.000 goal to "get to play all the calls" or a VS battle tournament.

 

But ehh... its like funding a DLC.

It's just starting. Certainly better stuff will come later on. The main points there are:

 

1- Pretty much every company do pre-orders...and pre-orders count as retail sales so it's expected pre-order gain not going to funding.

2- Several backers and non-backers asked for another opportunity of buying the game. Even here we heard this a few times. They simply allowing ppl to do what they asked.

3- VA is a bad start? Certainly...but it's something many backers asked and discussed about at official forums the past months. They just picked a simple yet popular backer request to start with.

 

What they did is perfectly normal based on the feedback and interests shown at official forum, KS and social media. In the end they simply hearing to backers and fanbase and reacting to the feedback received.

 

I must say i'm happy with this update. The new funding was something i've been waiting for a while already, the animation looks pretty good if you assume they just started it (Nick told the dudes made that model in just 3 weeks and that everything there is temporary. The serie is meant to be released only in 2016) so...

[56008]

I've said this before, but the amount of feedback /suggestions/interest from the forums is a very small sample of the existing 67,000 backers.  So to say that they "listen to the backers" is slightly misleading since we're only talking about a small group of people who they are catering to.  Let's not forget that there were plenty of people who also said that they didn't want voice acting!

 

At any rate, since I have the option of not taking part in this nor is it suppose to affect the current development of the game or how my funding is being used, I have no issues with the new fundraising campaign in principle.  But considering that there have been talks about budget issues with the game and also possible issues with getting the rewards out to us, asking for more money for something like THIS does raise a few eyebrows.

[Lienn]

It's not misleading at all. Forum activity is 100% voluntary, just like making use of Twitter, FB and KS comments. If one prefer to not offer feedback there's no way they can say what he thinks. 

 

And talking about misleading, mind if i ask the source of the "budget issues and possible issues with getting the rewards out to us" part? Tossing this kind of comment where there's people that cannot verify nor an official representation to reply is at least unfair, don't you think? Non-backers may not know here we have a somewhat biased opinion about the way official forums are being handled.

 

I respect the right of you guys to say w/e you feel like about anything regarding Comcept, Mn9, the forums, etc...but in a place where everyone is fully aware of the situation. While we may not agree with pretty much everything about the whole project you can see how many times i discussed opinions at backers forum...this because everyone there is aware of everything so they're able to take their own conclusions. But what about the non-backers here?

 

So i'd like to ask you to be a bit more reasonable when talking where non-backers can read. Thanks.

[icannotdomyjob]

@Lienn

I say, make a poll for it. See if backers, and fans, really want VAs. Add the JP version too. From what I am seeing, many are against this primary stretch goal.

 

About the budget issues, ask Comcept for finance sheets. With that, we can determine with evidence how the money is being used.

[56008]

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11438" data-time="1404748730">

It's not misleading at all. Forum activity is 100% voluntary, just like making use of Twitter, FB and KS comments. If one prefer to not offer feedback there's no way they can say what he thinks.

 

Bingo!  And that's one of the issues that we've brought up several times.  A lot suggestions for the game is taken just from the forums or other social media sources, when they are not tapping into the other 60,000+ backers that might have other suggestions, opinions or concerns regarding the game.  So yes, it is still "misleading" to say that they are listening to backer feedback when they completely ignore the majority of the group.  That's all I'm saying.

 

 

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11438" data-time="1404748730">

And talking about misleading, mind if i ask the source of the "budget issues and possible issues with getting the rewards out to us" part? Tossing this kind of comment where there's people that cannot verify nor an official representation to reply is at least unfair, don't you think? Non-backers may not know here we have a somewhat biased opinion about the way official forums are being handled.

 

I respect the right of you guys to say w/e you feel like about anything regarding Comcept, Mn9, the forums, etc...but in a place where everyone is fully aware of the situation. While we may not agree with pretty much everything about the whole project you can see how many times i discussed opinions at backers forum...this because everyone there is aware of everything so they're able to take their own conclusions. But what about the non-backers here?

 

So i'd like to ask you to be a bit more reasonable when talking where non-backers can read. Thanks.

 

Unfortunately since I've been permanently banned from the forums I can't give you a direct link to Nick's quotes, but from the comMutiny thread:

 

Regarding the budget for the game:

Here is the honest truth, we have enough to finish the game, but not enough to make it 100% the way we want. New ideas comes up everyday, but no new money coming in to make those ideas happen.

 

There are also several similar quotes that they are limited to what they can do because of budget, suggesting that they can't make the game completely the way they envisioned it and are unable to implement all of our ideas into the game (not suggesting that all of our ideas should get in, but it's limited).  There's also the issue how they didn't properly budget for the forums as well.

 

For rewards:

We honestly don't know how much we have to spend on rewards because of the shipping, and manufacture.

We will soon send out survey to gather all the info we need for the rewards fulfillment.

 

So yeah, they don't know how much it will cost.  And considering they made a blunder with the forums, who's to say that they didn't budget enough for the rewards as well?

 

Now you might be thinking "Well, you're just taking those quotes the wrong way.".  Hopefully I am, but looking at the subpar forum and now them asking for more money to work on the game the signs don't look good.

 

But at any rate, I do thank you for sharing your 2 cents in a respectable manner!

 

[quote author="pewpew" data-cid="11439" data-time="1404750120">

@Lienn

I say, make a poll for it. See if backers, and fans, really want VAs. Add the JP version too. From what I am seeing, many are against this primary stretch goal.

 

About the budget issues, ask Comcept for finance sheets. With that, we can determine with evidence how the money is being used.

 

And that's exactly what I've been asking for all this time, or at least something that tells us how they budgeted for the game.  I simply don't get why they don't provide some information to clarify this issue...unless of course there IS a budget issue that they don't want to publicly admit.

 

[Lienn]

Having limited budge and budge issues are different things. As example, I have limited budge...i can't buy 100% of the things i want...but i don't have budge issues...i have enough budge to pay my bills. About the second, it's expected them only having a estimated cost...there will be an year before they actually make the stuff. It's very easy to see financial predictions changing over the year. It's expected they only having an accurate cost by the time they start making/shipping the stuff. 

 

About polls, they mean nothing if people don't answer them. Patch's poll is an example of it...~17k backer only answered the poll. I know people who never answered anything...they simply backed it and left it alone. Again, it's all a voluntary thing. IMO it's an unneeded amount of effort to add poll for just a fraction answer. Fraction for fraction they have the people active at their 4 current interaction methods (KS, Forum, FB and Twitter).

 

About VA, indeed some are against it and some supports it. Most actually don't care about it at all...that's why i said IMO it wasn't a good starting goal. Still, it's a recurring topic since the forums started so it's expected the dev team being aware of the backers interest on it.

[icannotdomyjob]

@Lienn

We know what having a budget means, and having issues. We are asking for that budget: the finance sheets that show how they have fulfilled, or missed, that budget.

 

Experienced budgeters, e.g. Business analysts, overestimate prices in case issues arise, and plan according to multiple variables, including inflation. They also contact potential clients for estimates, to ensure they have a working budget before they embark on a project.

 

The people choosen to analyze finances for Comcept, have very dubious practices, and their experience lacking.

Spoiler

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=DDM+agency+news

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Judd_%28producer%29

http://www.ddmagency.com/team/ben-judd/

 

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=Nick+Yu+comcept

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=Nick+Yu+Yaiba

http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/credit/117367.html

http://www.mobygames.com/developer/sheet/view/developerId,629243/

 

Example:

http://venturebeat.com/2013/09/24/ddm-talent-agency-pulls-strings-to-make-mighty-no-9s-crowdfunding-a-success/

 

 

And about the poll, it's the only way to know for sure what people want, without weeding through thousands of comments ridden in all the communication venues, and interpreting the posts correctly. No one wants biased decisions.

 

But if you kept up with the news, Comcept will do what they like, hoping fans are pleasantly surprised.

[TheCloudyEye]

Regarding the cost of shipping, it's somewhat confusing when Nick said they don't know how much they have to spent. Since they already asked backers to add extra for international shipping, they should at the very least know that much.

[Lienn]

[quote author="TheCloudyEye" data-cid="11443" data-time="1404755656">

Regarding the cost of shipping, it's somewhat confusing when Nick said they don't know how much they have to spent. Since they already asked backers to add extra for international shipping, they should at the very least know that much.

They have an estimated value only. Doubtfully they would do a zip code check tor an accurate shipping cost for everyone...especially since there's international shipping too. That's something he will only be able to be accurate when the shipping start.

 

@Pewpew: Same i asked to Wakko. Mind in posting source for "has very dubious practices, and their experience lacking."? Do they have criminal record of some kind or something else that proves this statement? Did they bankrupt a company or at least a project already?

[TheCloudyEye]

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11444" data-time="1404755931">

They have an estimated value only.

And people already paid them that much.

 

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11444" data-time="1404755931">

That's something he will only be able to be accurate when the shipping start.

What happen if it turns out to be more than the estimated value that backers already paid for?

[Lienn]

[quote author="TheCloudyEye" data-cid="11446" data-time="1404756162">

And people already paid them that much.

 

What happen if it turned out to be more than the estimated value that backers already paid for?

Indeed. And certainly it was properly estimated. The risk of price changes is not a Comcept issue. It's a risk every single project with physical goods has. The "What if" will ever exist, regardless of company or product and no one can judge them unable to properly do this before they even trying. One witch hunt at project is enough IMO.

 

Also, let's face it...just the leftovers past the 4M may pay most of the rewards and shipping. They have over 30k leftovers. It may pay most (if not all) physical rewards and shipping. None of the rewards can be considered at least remotely expensive.

[TheCloudyEye]

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11447" data-time="1404756860">

Indeed. And certainly it was properly estimated

I sure hope they did.

 

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11447" data-time="1404756860">

Also, let's face it...just the leftovers past the 4M may pay most of the rewards and shipping. They have over 30k leftovers. It may pay most (if not all) physical rewards and shipping. None of the rewards can be considered at least remotely expensive.

Interesting. Last I heard, their budget seems pretty tight. So where does this 30k leftover come from?

[Lienn]

[quote author="TheCloudyEye" data-cid="11448" data-time="1404757120">

I sure hope they did.

 

Interesting. Last I heard, their budget seems pretty tight. So where does this 30k leftover come from?

The project, with all stretch goals cost 4M. From KS + Paypal they got ~4M30K. This 30K is a hella buffer IMO.

[TheCloudyEye]

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11449" data-time="1404757340">

The project, with all stretch goals cost 4M. From KS + Paypal they got ~4M30K. This 30K is a hella buffer IMO.

That only works on paper. In reality, that leftover pile could be used for many different purposes, not just fulfilling the rewards. Also, let's not forget that the cash they received for international shipping should be reserved for that purpose and not used for game development, but we don't know how much that is.

[icannotdomyjob]

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11444" data-time="1404755931">

They have an estimated value only.

Please, cite where you got this bit of information.


 

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11444" data-time="1404755931">

Doubtfully they would do a zip code check tor an accurate shipping cost for everyone

Experienced Business analysts would already have the shipping costs calculated looking at trends. Since everything is documented on Kickstarter and Paypal, they should have a very rough estimate on all shipping costs since the next day of funding. Additionally, they should have a shipping agency to ask for estimates immediately, and begin the process asking where to ship to.


Physical things need to be dealt with first before digital, since inflation is rampant on the shipping industry.


 

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11444" data-time="1404755931">

Mind in posting source for "has very dubious practices, and their experience lacking."? Do they have criminal record of some kind or something else that proves this statement? Did they bankrupt a company or at least a project already?

On the http://www.mightyno9universe.com/index.php?/topic/2497-so-abouth-the-new-kickstarter/page-2#entry11442">spoilered text.

 

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11447" data-time="1404756860">

The risk of price changes is not a Comcept issue.

It is, if they properly budgeted the project. They should have on demand contacts to ask for any price changes, and adapt accordingly. Experienced Analysts plan accordingly before a project even begins.

 

[quote author="Lienn" data-cid="11447" data-time="1404756860">

It's a risk every single project with physical goods has. The "What if" will ever exist, regardless of company or product and no one can judge them unable to properly do this before they even trying. One witch hunt at project is enough IMO.

Risks are everywhere, even the moment you posted and read this. It still does not stop an Analyst to properly summon all clients, get estimates, learn shipping costs, ask addresses, and begin the shipping process as soon as possible, since shipping is a volatile industry.



Most importantly, if we had the finance sheets, this discussion would be very different, than just speculation




Side Comment:

Spoiler

I always review my sources before I post. It's preposterous to speak without proof. And search engines are plentiful for finding information without the need to cite facts these days.